Jewish Supremacism Exposed:
An Interview With Mark Weber,
American Dissident Voices broadcast
April 10, 2004
Kevin Alfred Strom
Today we continue our interview with Mark Weber, Director of the
Institute for Historical Review. We'll look at Ernst Zündel's
legacy of freedom and we'll explore the potential positive
consequences of Jewish arrogance and miscalculation in this
KAS: Well, I'll say this: if the Jewish power structure wanted to
silence Ernst Zündel, they have utterly failed. Because of their
persecution of this gentle man, they've brought his ideas to
millions of people who might never have heard of him before.
WEBER: Well, even some people who hate Ernst Zündel have been a
little surprised. Here he was, living rather quietly in
Tennessee. He was arrested in February and -- especially in the
first months after his arrest -- the Zündel case was front-page
news in newspapers all across Canada and on national television
and radio. I was interviewed for national radio and television in
that regard myself, but people had more or less forgotten to some
degree about Ernst Zündel. Because he had moved to the United
States, he was not really in the headlines very much and suddenly
the thing was a big story again.
Since his arrest it's continued to be played up again by those
people who insist that this injustice has to be known. Indeed, if
he were deported to Germany and held there it could well turn out
that that could lead to yet another explosion of activity and
interest in the case over in Europe, where the Zündel case is not
so well known. Now, of course, that's not something we look
forward to or want, but it's similar to what's happening around
the world. The more Ariel Sharon tries to stamp out the
Palestinians' resistance to the occupation, the more the
resistance seems to grow.
KAS: And the more oppression and injustice that the Jewish
establishment rains down upon Ernst Zündel's head, the more
people will look upon Ernst Zündel's ideas with an open mind.
WEBER: Well, there's also a parallel, too, with the efforts by
these same organizations to silence or suppress the Mel Gibson
film. That failed, and the film is certainly one of the most
successful motion pictures of the time right now. But the anger
and fury and hatred against Gibson that came out before and
during the film's release and that continues to come out because
of the film has actually had the effect of increasing the
interest of people who normally would not perhaps have been so
interested in it and made them want to see it.
KAS: Well, not only are more people seeing the film, but they're
going there with a very sharpened awareness of the Jewish
question surrounding the portrayed actions two thousand years ago
and their parallels in the modern world.
WEBER: That's quite true, and I think it just shows a tremendous
and really crazy misperception to think that because the film was
shown it would lead to some sort of violence. The Film's been out
now more than a month, and as far as I know, there's not one
report of any Jewish person being physically hurt or attacked
because of the film. But what has happened -- and even some
Jewish writers have noticed this with alarm -- is that millions
of people are outraged, not because of what is depicted in the
film, but because of the behavior of Jewish groups over the past
year in denigrating and trying to suppress it.
KAS: It seems they've gotten precisely the opposite results that
they wanted from their campaign.
WEBER: Well, I think it shows just a real miscalculation about
the mentality of the people they're dealing with. It's a pattern,
as I've said many times, that's repeated over and over again in
history. When people get powerful and arrogant they become
reckless and they miscalculate and that's what's happening again
in this case.
KAS: Well, to me that's encouraging. Can you tell me what you've
been doing to bring the Zündel case to a wider audience?
WEBER: Shortly after Ernst was arrested, his wife Ingrid called
me -- and she had consulted with Ernst about this as well -- and
asked me to deal with what was at that time a flood of requests
for interviews and so forth that were coming out, and I readily
agreed. I've known Ernst for years; I've testified in a couple of
his cases and I've written a lot about him and we've welcomed him
as a speaker at our conferences, so I readily agreed. As a result
of that, there have been many, many interviews and guest
appearances over the past year relating to the Zündel case.
Now, most of them -- and the highest-profile of these -- were in
the weeks immediately after his arrest, when this was a big case
in Canada, as I mentioned earlier. Over the past year, I've
continued to appear on a lot of radio and television shows and
have given interviews to print journalists as well, trying to
keep up interest in the case. I've been very gratified by how
many radio stations -- especially independent ones -- and talk
show hosts have picked up on this. Just the other week I did
another interview on the Jeff Rense Show, which is broadcast on
what I think is called the Talk Radio Network and also online as
well. He's a person who reaches mainly a listenership very
different than what American Dissident Voices does.
KAS: It's sort of a New-Age type of radio show.
WEBER: It's sort of a New Age thing. He deals with health issues,
and lots of alternative views of the world, and culture, and so
forth, but he has really picked up the ball on the Zündel case.
He says this is an outrage. He's very concerned about the erosion
of freedoms in our society, and rightly so.
KAS: Was Mrs. Zündel also a guest on his show?
WEBER: The very first time he did an interview on this story she
was on the show, and I was on as well. That was just very shortly
after the arrest. But since then she has not been on his show.
I've been on, I think, six times now.
KAS: Well, I'm going to have to have you on more often, so he
doesn't pass me in the Mark Weber interview department! What does
it tell you , Mark, that Mr. Rense is willing to cordially
discuss Mr. Zündel and some of his revisionist concepts, and that
mainstream station owners who carry his show are happy to have
that kind of programming on their airwaves?
WEBER: Well, he has suffered as a result. There have been threats
of boycotts and withdrawal of advertising. This is a pretty major
show; it has substantial advertising. One of the features of his
show, as opposed to American Dissident Voices, is that it's
interrupted repeatedly with ads for this, that, and the other
thing, but he's determined to stick it out anyway. It reminds me
of the company in Florida that rents out billboard space and that
came under pressure because of the National Alliance billboard
that appeared down there. Now, again, Rense is a little more
independent than others, so he can afford to stick his neck out a
little further than some other people might, but there'll be more
people like this, I'm sure, in the years ahead.
KAS: So you think we are seeing something of a loosening of
Jewish-enforced political correctness?
WEBER: I think that's happening all over the world. America is
the great bastion of Jewish power. And I've repeatedly referred
to it, but as the Prime Minister of Malaysia said in October,
Jews are so powerful that they're practically able to rule the
world through proxy -- especially through the United States --
and to get other people to fight and die and kill for them. Now,
perhaps it's overstated, but the central truth of what he said
is, I think, more and more apparent to everyone. America is the
country where it's going to be most difficult, because this is
the great bastion of Jewish power. A few weeks ago I slipped in
with someone else to an AIPAC meeting -- the American Israel
Public Affairs Committee. It was at a large synagogue in Newport
Beach and it was publicly announced. It wasn't restricted to
Jews, although there were very, very few non-Jews there. There
were maybe 900 -- that's what they said, 800 or 900 -- Jews from
the Newport Beach area of California. This is a very wealthy area
and this was at a large synagogue. One of the main speakers was
the congressman for the area, Chris Cox, who gave a sort of
report on what he's doing to help their interests. It's very
useful to come to a meeting like that, because what it does is
reinforce our awareness. You may know this and I may know this,
but it's hard for most non-Jews to realize just how determined,
how focused Jews are in the United States to support their
I mean, this was in a synagogue, but it certainly didn't have
anything to do with God, or with religion in the sense that most
people think of it; this was a meeting about power and how to
hold onto it. One of the points that was made over and over in
this -- really, really -- is that the United States is the last
country in the world, really, that supports Israel. This is the
bastion; it's the only real bastion of support left. The point
that was made is that, for that reason, it's all the more
important to give money to AIPAC, which is the central Jewish
lobbying institution -- it's a pro-Israel lobbying institution in
Washington D.C. -- in order to keep U.S. Congressmen herded
inside the corral and make sure they don't cause any trouble,
because without that support Israel is really doomed.
This is a country whose days would be numbered without the
constant, continual influx of support and money and weaponry and
diplomatic support from the United States, and this was a major
theme of the meeting. It's really remarkable -- especially for
non-Jews -- to ever even read about meetings like that, because I
think they sort of think that a synagogue is something like a
church and that people who go there are praying for world peace,
or perhaps they're praying because somebody's going to have an
operation, or else they're praying to lead good lives. Well, at
this synagogue there wasn't anything about that. This was all
about power and group interests and that was the whole point. And
when one group is that determined and that focused, it's much,
much easier for it when everyone else is just sort of worrying
about their own, individual private concerns.
KAS: Were you allowed to introduce yourself and ask a few
WEBER: (laughs) I was hoping that nobody would recognize me
because there could have been a little embarrassment there if I
had been recognized. There were a few non-Jews, but
overwhelmingly -- I'd say 98% -- were Jews; it was a Jewish
meeting. It wasn't a private meeting; it was announced in the
newspaper before I went. I was mainly interested to see how the
congressman would speak to these people. I didn't realize how
extensive a meeting it would be.
KAS: Well, very interesting analysis. Perhaps you're going to
write something about the meeting?
WEBER: Well, I think I will. I've already written up something
about it and I'll probably fine-tune it and send it out.
KAS: In last week's Toronto Star we saw an editorial by a Jewish
attorney, Alan Young, which might be viewed as the polar opposite
of the editorial you mentioned in the Globe and Mail. First,
Young invokes the National Alliance, William Pierce, Jim
Keegstra, and Ernst Zündel as examples of "haters," and then he
goes on to openly advocate torture and Clockwork Orange-style
mental reprogramming for haters. If you'll allow me, just let me
quote a portion of this incredible editorial and then I'll ask
for your comments on it. This is Alan Young, Jewish attorney:
"It is bizarre that criminal justice officials try to do more to
change the belief and behavior of johns charged with prostitution
than they do with the Ernst Zündels and Jim Keegstras of the
world. Just as some cancers require invasive surgery, the hate
crime needs intrusive measures. The usual 'out of sight, out of
mind' approach to modern punishment just won't work in this case.
For crimes of extreme stupidity we need Clockwork Orange justice,
strapping the hate criminal into a chair for an interminable
period and keeping his eyes wide open with metal clamps so he
cannot escape from an onslaught of cinematic imagery carefully
designed to break his neurotic attachment to self-induced
intellectual impairment. In the context of hate crime, I do have
some regrets that we have a constitutional prohibition on cruel
and unusual punishment. I don't think coercive persuasion or
deprogramming is necessarily cruel, but as a state sanction it is
unusual. However, if the crime is unique, the sanctions should be
also. Simply dishing out more prison time or a larger fine is a
dead end. We need a punishment that can kick-start a brain."
What do you have to say to that, Mark?
WEBER: Well, I think this is very valuable, and again, people
ought to remember this. This shows the kind of mentality that
people like Alan Young and Jewish leaders generally have with
regard to non-Jews. They view non-Jews as essentially sort of
stupid and as people who have to be guided along because they
might start getting the wrong idea. Something like that mentality
is already operating in society -- not in the narrow sense that
he speaks of it -- but in the constant reiteration in our society
of this holocaust story, which is designed to do the same thing
-- that is, make non-Jews believe that whatever Jews want should
be approved because they're so altruistic and noble and innocent
and defenseless that saying no to anything that Jewish groups
want is just almost a crime, it's a terrible thing. And Americans
are fed an enormous amount of propaganda to bolster that image.
But it shows something else, too. It shows that those people who
oppose Jewish power and Jewish intrigues are regarded as just
mentally sick. Now, this gets to a real central question, and one
that people have tried to deal with throughout the ages. Why does
this perpetual thing called the Jewish question keep recurring?
Or, to put it another way, why does anti-Semitism exist? Of
course, it's a stupid term, it's a misnomer, but why does this
Now, Elie Wiesel's explanation for it is that it's just a
mystery. It's like some virus in the air -- a bug that somehow
people get for no good reason and suddenly there's this big
problem. Well, that's just absurd. It's a complete negation of
reality, of how human beings act, and of how history is. To his
credit -- and I've cited this -- Theordor Herzl, the founder of
modern Zionism, deals with this question in his book The Jewish
State, which is the seminal, central manifesto, you might say, of
modern Zionism. He says that anti-Semitism exists as a perfectly
understandable and natural reaction of non-Jews to the fact that
Jews in the societies in which they live regard themselves as a
separate people, and yet they push interests that are contrary to
those of the people among whom they live. And he says it's
absolutely understandable that non-Jews are going to be
infuriated and angry about this eventually.
KAS: That's common sense.
WEBER: That's just common sense. So Herzl's solution to this
problem is for Jews to give up living among non-Jews and go live
in a separate country of their own and become what he calls "a
normal people." Well, it hasn't worked that way, but that's his
solution. The point is that at least he makes some rational,
sensible analysis of this problem. For Alan Young, this Jewish
attorney you're quoting, this is just inexplicable because he's
unable -- completely unable -- to see things from the point of
view of non-Jews. Why should the Jews be surprised, for example,
if Frenchmen want to keep France as French as Jews want to keep
Israel Jewish? It's a perfectly understandable phenomenon that
Japanese want to keep Japan Japanese, French want to keep France
French, and so forth. Wherever people have some loyalties to
their heritage and their culture, that's perfectly
understandable. Of course, Jews insist upon it for themselves,
but they seem incapable of understanding that non-Jews can have
exactly the same sentiments and feelings, and that they don't
like it when a group that's not of their own kind come in and
take huge amounts of power and push the cultural and political
agenda of this society in a way that's contrary to feelings and
interests of the people.
KAS: I was just astounded in the editorial by his attitude that
those who disagree, who have a different point of view, are to be
treated in an inhumane way; they're going to be tortured until
they submit, until they change their minds. It's just astounding
WEBER: Yes, it is. It's astonishing. Now, this phenomenon is
explored in some detail by Professor Kevin McDonald in the three
books that he's written on Judaism and Jewish behavior throughout
history. And he talks in there over and over of a kind of myopia,
a misperception the Jews have about not only themselves and their
relationship to non-Jews, but about how non-Jews are as well. And
we see this over and over in a kind of overreaching and
arrogance, and we're seeing it again now around the world.
One of the things that's just bizarre and very difficult, I
think, for non-Jews to understand is that -- and you see this in
the Old Testament and in Jewish movies and books and so forth --
Jews regard the tremendous hostility toward them that has erupted
time and time again in the past not as any reflection of anything
bad on their part, but in fact as a confirmation of how good they
are. You see this in the Old Testament. It's in the book of
Genesis in talking about the Jews in Egypt; you find it in the
book of Esther about the Jews in Babylon.
Persecution is just further evidence for many Jews of Jewish
nobility and chosenness and greatness. Now, many other people
would just step back and say, "Well, maybe there's some
relationship between the way Jews act and what people think of
Jews." But for Jews -- in overwhelming numbers -- this isn't how
they look at it. There's almost a kind of perverse pride in
looking at what happens and saying "Well, they hate us," because
that hatred is regarded as a kind of badge of distinction or a
badge of honor.
KAS: What do you think of the idea that the climax, the peak of
Jewish power sometimes precedes an awakening of people to that
WEBER: Well, there was a time when I thought that the apex -- the
high point -- had already been reached. I thought it was perhaps
even back about twenty, thirty years ago, when Nixon was
president, during the 1973 war. But I've been amazed that just
when I thought it couldn't get any worse, it continues to go that
way. And it's now increasingly obvious, I think, that the
American government is willing more and more blatantly than ever
to betray and jeopardize not only the interests of humanity, but
also American interests in this mad alliance with Israel. You see
this just more and more vividly with each passing week.
Increasingly it's clear to the world -- and should be more clear
to Americans -- that the United States and Israel are virtually
alone; there's no real strong support for this crazy alliance.
When American politicians say they're committed to Israel -- that
they're going to guarantee Israel's existence -- Americans should
pay close attention, because the implications of this are that
they'll spend just countless billions of dollars and expend many,
many more American lives for this crazy alliance. That's more and
more obvious, so I've been surprised that it's been pushed this
KAS: Which way are we going in this country? Is Jewish arrogance
going to have even more of a field day with the Constitution than
it already has, trashing our rights, jailing dissidents, or have
the Jews overplayed their hand?
WEBER: Well, that's hard to say, but there was an amazing piece
just the other day in the Los Angeles Times analyzing how
Rumsfeld is making plans for a military government in the United
States to take over in case of a big terrorist attack that would
supposedly paralyze our political structure. That's a dangerous
thing, and I remember William Pierce predicted that things were
going to get a lot worse before they were going to get any better
and I've been amazed at how prescient, how far-sighted his
predictions turned out to be. A year before the 9-11 attack,
William Pierce wrote a piece in which he predicted -- rather
amazingly -- that there could very well be an attack on the World
Trade Center. I think he wrote, "Well, if you're walking around
lower Manhattan in New York, you'd better wear a hard hat because
the World Trade Center, this big symbol of American financial
power, could very well be attacked."
KAS: He also gave a general warning: "Stay out of tall
WEBER: "Stay out of tall buildings." That's pretty amazing! If
the Bush administration officials had listened to Pierce more
than someone else, they might have done something to prevent the
KAS: Well, as long as we have our freedom of speech, let's keep
pressing for a greater awareness among our people, and hopefully
that will bring a change in the world -- a change for the better.
And I thank you, Mark, for all you're doing and all the Institute
for Historical Review is doing to bring reason and truth to the
people, and I thank you for being our guest on American Dissident
WEBER: Well, thank you again, Kevin. All the best to you.