Resistance to Jewish Power:
and Zundel Case Update, Part 1
American Dissident Voices broadcast
September 13, 2003
Kevin Alfred Strom
Today, I'll be speaking to you about a new pro-White media outlet
we've just created; I'll interview Mark Weber on the latest
developments in the Ernst Zundel case; and I'll tell you about
how sporting goods retailer Cabela's has fired a National
Alliance member just because he expressed his political views.
This week we have launched a new venture in White media, in media
not controlled by the Jewish establishment, not controlled by any
government, and not controlled by stateless and raceless
corporate interests. We have launched a daily-updated news and
information and entertainment source run by National Alliance
members, by members of the White community who will write,
inform, and entertain you from the White point of view; who will
speak for us and in our interests. It's NationalVanguard.org, the
online daily news and comment adjunct to National Vanguard print
magazine. This Internet site will also keep National Alliance
members and non-members alike informed of developments in the
Alliance and in the activism and outreach of our members across
North America and the world. The site is a cooperative venture of
our editors and readers -- you are encouraged to submit your own
reports and articles for inclusion on the site. The site has only
been on-line for a few days and already some irresponsible
anti-National Alliance sites have been copying articles from it
and using them without proper attribution -- which is a kind of
flattery, I suppose.
Take a look at http://www.nationalvanguard.org/
and tell us what
you think. I hope you'll be inspired to join with us and
participate in making the site a success.
With the addition of NationalVanguard.org, the National
Alliance's pro-White media take another step forward: we
integrate American Dissident Voices and NA Live weekly radio,
with Free Speech magazine for printed transcripts of this
program, with the monthly official members' Bulletin, with
National Vanguard magazine for feature articles, with our main
Web sites at http://natvan.com
online publications, news articles and archives and membership
info, with regional activism Web sites, with Resistance.com and
Resistance magazine for the youth and music markets, and now a
daily source of news and comment for our growing community at
NationalVanguard.org. Please join us.
Today we have as our guest Mr. Mark Weber, the Director of the
Institute for Historical Review, who will update us on what has
been happening in the case of revisionist writer and publisher
Ernst Zundel, who was expelled from the U.S. and is now held as a
political prisoner in Canada.
* * *
KAS: Welcome to American Dissident Voices, Mark Weber. Mark, ever
since Ernst Zundel was arrested in February in Tennessee, you've
been the media spokesman for the Zundels. I understand that
Ingrid Zundel asked you to do that so that she would be free to
work for her husband's release on other fronts. May I ask, first,
how she is doing?
MW: She's carrying a tremendous load at their home in Tennessee
without Ernst. She's been putting out the newsletter ever since
his arrest. She has to coordinate the support that Ernst has from
all over the country and even around the world. As a result of
the Zundel matter, her workload has increased tremendously, not
just because she doesn't have her husband, but because he's now
more in the news and there's more going on than there has been in
the two and a half years they were living pretty quietly there.
But the big problem is that she is fearful -- rightly and
understandably so -- that she may never see her husband again.
The danger is that Canadian authorities will put him on a plane,
send him off to Germany, and that he'll be put in jail in Germany
and may never even return to North America. And she not only has
the concerns that anyone would have who's a colleague of Ernst
Zundel, but also the very special concerns and worries that a
wife has for her husband.
KAS: Indeed. I can understand that. You mentioned a newsletter.
Is this a print newsletter or an Internet newsletter?
MW: It's both -- or several things. She puts out a newsletter
that Ernst has been putting out for years, reporting on his
activities and his observations, and so forth. And now she has to
compile that and put that out. In addition, Ingrid puts out --
every day -- her so-called Zgrams. These are email messages that
she sends to a large email subscriber list. And these are
archived on the Zundelsite Web site.
It should be obvious, by the way, more than ever, that
responsibility for the Zundelsite is really Ingrid's. She started
this site, and even though it's called the Zundelsite, it's
really the work of Ingrid Rimland. [Rimland is Mrs. Zundel's
maiden name, which she retains for much of her literary work. --
KAS] That's important to note, because the last big legal battle
that Ernst fought in Canada, before he decided to move to the
United States, was precisely over that Web site. And the Canadian
authorities contended, and the Jewish groups charged, that he was
really the one operating this Web site. And he contended -- and I
know it's true -- that he doesn't even access the Web site
himself. There's a lot of material on the Web site, granted, that
he has written; but the responsibility for it is really with his
wife, Ingrid. And it was with Ingrid before they were even
married. One of the interesting aspects of all of this, too, is
that at the recent hearing that was held in Canada, in which the
Zundel side once again asked for bail and was turned down, the
judge focused tremendously on the Zundelsite. Zundel insisted,
'Look, I don't run this site. I'm almost computer illiterate.'
Which in fact I know to be true. And the judge focused on this.
It was an encouraging development: The fact that the judge
focused on that indicated that he did not feel that the case that
the Canadian government's equivalent of the FBI -- the CSIS
(Canadian Security and Intelligence Service) -- had made was very
strong. Their case -- that he's a "threat to national security"
-- is so empty that the judge doesn't feel that he can rely on
that, but instead has to focus on this Web site. It's never been
a contention of the Canadian authorities that this Web site is
part of their case that he's a "threat to national security."
KAS: And the Zundelsite has always been Ingrid Zundel's
responsibility, not Ernst's.
MW: Yes, even before they were married and she lived in
California. That's right.
KAS: How can one subscribe to the newsletters you mentioned?
MW: Just click on to the Zundelsite. Or you can go the IHR's site
] and go to the links -- we of course have
a link to it. And there's a place to subscribe to her Zgrams.
She's very easy to contact. So she puts out the newsletter; she
has to manage donations and coordination of her supporters; and
one of the biggest battles she has is to coordinate the legal
campaign. They have lawyers both in Canada and the United States
who are fighting this case. And she has to organize that, and
raise money for their support. Another thing she's done is to
place a large full-page ad in the Washington Times
on behalf of
her husband in the form of an open letter to Russian president
Vladimir Putin, asking for his help to pressure the United States
or ask the United States to release him. She did that, in part,
because Ingrid Rimland was actually born in Russia.
KAS: I see.
MW: She was from a small Mennonite German community, settlers who
had lived for many years in Russia. They were German-speaking
people. At the end of World War II, as a girl, along with
millions of other people who were refugees, she went westward
when the German army and the Axis armies were retreating. Rather
than live under Communist rule, they fled to the west with the
German forces as they were retreating. She grew up, and spent
some later years after that, in South America with this Mennonite
community, and then came to California and made a life here.
KAS: Has she received any response from the Russian government?
[Since this program was recorded, another, more extensive ad has
run in the Russian newspaper Zavtra. See
MW: Not that I know of, no. In fact the main purpose of the
advertisement was to make the case better known in the American
media and to the American public in general. It's a tragic thing,
a sad thing, and I think a sad commentary that there's been very
little coverage of the whole Zundel matter here in the United
States media. It's been widely covered in the Canadian media
because Ernst Zundel is a well known -- if 'infamous' -- figure
in Canada. He's well known in that country, and as soon as he was
arrested it was big news all over Canada, a front page story in
major newspapers. But almost nothing has appeared about it here
in the American media. I spoke to a reporter for one major
newspaper, and he had some interest in it, but then he just asked
me, 'Well why is this a story for America?' And I gave what I
thought was a pretty good case for why this story deserves to be
covered in the American media, but he never followed up and never
wrote a story on it. So it's gotten very little coverage in the
KAS: When we last spoke about this case on this program, Ernst
Zundel had been transferred from New York to Ontario, and he was
awaiting hearings on possible deportation to Germany, where he
would surely be prosecuted and imprisoned for his writings. So
really there are two 'sides' to this case. What is happening on
the U.S. side of this case?
MW: On the U.S. side, Ingrid is -- with a very tenacious lawyer
here -- trying to appeal the arrest of her husband. And she has a
strong case that the arrest was on a pretext. It's almost unheard
of that a person living in the United States, who's married to an
American citizen -- and this is really an important feature of it
-- is just picked up on the grounds that he has broken some
procedural regulation. That's the claim. He supposedly missed an
appointment of some kind. Now I don't know precisely what
happened, but Ingrid and Ernst both tell me that this is bogus --
that they were not notified of this meeting. And I know from my
experience, and I know Ernst pretty well and I know the record of
the man, that he's very careful about obeying the law. He is, if
anything, super-careful. He tries to be like Caesar's wife, above
suspicion. And throughout the whole lengthy legal ordeal that he
faced in Canada, he was very punctilious and very careful to
abide by every jot and tittle of the law there. Now, whatever the
truth of the matter, even if he had missed a hearing, the notion
that INS and local police just pick up this guy and put him in
jail and then deport him for this -- considering that he's
married to an American citizen and considering the way that
American authorities overlook the presence of literally millions
of illegal aliens here in this country -- it's just so obviously
a focus on Ernst because of who he is and what he's done and what
KAS: Has this tenacious lawyer managed to gain the right to a new
hearing of any kind?
MW: Not yet, no. And it will be difficult. But at least on the
merits of the case, there's a strong argument to be made that his
arrest was improper. But we're living in very unusual times, in
which all sorts of safeguards of the law are being bent now,
during a time our President calls this unlimited "war on
terrorism" -- which he claims is going to go on for years. And in
the name of that "war on terrorism," all sorts of very unusual
things are happening in the United States: holding people without
charges, and reportedly the mistreatment and torture of people,
even if only on U.S. Army bases offshore. All of this is very
ominous, and this is a very difficult time to be fighting for
civil liberties as Ernst Zundel and his wife are doing.
KAS: Certainly. It sounds like terror is what's going on under
the guise of the "war on terrorism." What is happening on the
Canadian side of the border in this case?
MW: On the Canadian side, it's kind of a standoff right now. The
Canadian authorities claim, on the basis of evidence that they
will not make completely public, that Ernst Zundel is a threat to
the national security of Canada. It sounds like I'm special
pleading, but the case is really just ridiculous. Ernst Zundel
lived for 42 years in Canada without a criminal record, and no
one during that time ever alleged he was any kind of threat to
national security. To claim that now, after living in the United
States for two and a half years, he would suddenly be a threat to
the national security of Canada, after 42 years of living in the
country with an unblemished record, is just absurd on the face of
it. Now, more to the point, the case against him -- at least the
part that's been made public -- simply alleges that he's met with
people who are so-called White supremacists. Even the Canadian
authorities acknowledge that Ernst Zundel has never advocated
violence of any kind, that he's not a violent person. Indeed,
he's repeatedly been the victim of violence in Canada, especially
violence from Jewish terrorist groups.
KAS: He's a pacifist, isn't he?
MW: He's a pacifist. That's why he moved to Canada in the first
place -- to avoid, of all things, service in the German army
after World War II. A number of fairly prominent mainstream
voices in Canada, who are no friends of Ernst Zundel,
nevertheless have acknowledged that the case against Zundel as a
"threat to national security" is just a bogus pretext. And it
takes some courage to say that right now in Canada. I was
gratified, as I mentioned earlier, that the judge during the last
hearing focused so much on the Web site. If there was really any
kind of case to be made that Zundel actually was a threat to
national security, the judge would really have no need to grill
him about his wife's Web site in the United States.
KAS: What was the purpose of that hearing?
MW: The purposes of that hearing -- and there's another one
scheduled for later this month -- are 1) to appeal for bail, so
that he doesn't have be held as he has been, in solitary
confinement under really humiliating circumstances, and 2) Ernst
Zundel's attorney, who has been Doug Christie, is appealing the
case on Constitutional grounds, arguing that the whole procedure
under which he's being held is unconstitutional. For example, one
major feature of it is that the Canadian authorities present the
evidence to the judge "in camera" -- that is, IN SECRET. And
Ernst Zundel is not able -- and his attorney is not able -- even
to respond to it. Now this is a violation of a very basic
principle of English or British or European common law: A
defendant has the right to know what the evidence is against him,
so he can try to deal with it. The problem is that now, under
this sort of new order we're living under, when authorities call
out "national security!" then all the normal safeguards go flying
out the window.
KAS: We've recently published a letter from Ernst Zundel on our
It appears that Mr. Zundel's spirit and determination are as
strong as ever. Is that true?
MW: That's the impression I have. I've spoken with him several
times by telephone. He calls collect; he is permitted to make
telephone calls out. His spirits seem very very good. Of course,
it takes a toll to some degree that he's held in prison in
solitary confinement in this way. But the same spirit that was so
infectious and so strong during the two major trials that he
fought in Canada in 1985 and 1988 is every bit as manifest and
still in evidence. He's positive and upbeat, but at the same time
sober and realistic about just how difficult the situation is.
And that's Ernst to a "T."
KAS: We've heard some reports that his health has been suffering
while he's been incarcerated. What can you say about that?
MW: Well, I asked him about that, of course; everybody does who
speaks with him. And he said that it's true that he had some pain
and so forth, but his health is still to all accounts good. He is
worried that he's been prohibited from taking the herbal
medicines and herbal treatments that he's been used to. And even
the judge ordered the authorities to do something about that.
It's that kind of petty, you might say harassing, treatment of
Zundel that is particularly irritating and humiliating and
KAS: You told me earlier today that you were writing an essay on
Mr. Zundel's plight. Where can we read that?
MW: It's being written for a monthly paper in Sacramento called
Community News, which is put out by a man named Walter Mueller,
who's a friend of the IHR. It's going to be entitled "Who is
Ernst Zundel and Why is He In Jail?" It's meant as an
introductory piece for people who don't know anything about the
case. Except for those who are 'in the circle' here in the United
States, Ernst Zundel is not a well known figure. I want to
present, in a compact way, the highlights of the case and stress
the injustice and why it's important for us. It's important
because, while he's an obvious target, he is a political
prisoner. And when the Canadian government, in cahoots with the
United States government, arrests someone, deports him, and holds
him for now more than six months in solitary confinement, without
bail, without any criminal charges, that's dangerous for all of
us, especially those of us who treasure our right to express our
opinions even if they run counter to the Politically Correct
dogma of our times.
KAS: It sounds like something that more people ought to read in
the United States. Would you be willing to give us the rights to
reprint that article on our own sites?
MW: That would be fine. We encourage the maximum distribution and
circulation of everything that we put out. And especially the
Ernst Zundel case deserves to be very well known. Ernst Zundel is
the personification right now of oppression of Politically
Incorrect views in North America.
KAS: The National Alliance recently held a demonstration in
support of Ernst Zundel in Seattle. Have there been any other
public events to protest this political imprisonment?
MW: Yes. It's gratifying and encouraging that there have been
several demonstrations in Canada, organized by the Canadian
Association for Free Expression headed by Paul Fromm. We
organized a demonstration in May in Los Angeles at the Canadian
consulate there, and I met with the consul and presented him a
letter, which expressed our outrage at the treatment of this man.
And we coordinated that with a demonstration in Seattle at the
time. We're trying to organize other demonstrations, too, in
other cities. But, as I say, it's a difficult thing because the
Zundel case is not well known outside of Canada, except among
those who are already in on it, or who are already supporters of
Ernst Zundel and the rights that he stands for.
* * *
Next week we'll continue our discussion with Mark Weber of the
Institute for Historical Review, on the Zundel case and on the
increasing use of Jewish power to censor and imprison free
thinkers around the world. You can read the text of the full-page
Zundel ads in the Washington Times and in the Russian newspaper
Zavtra on our news site http://www.nationalvanguard.org/. Just
click on the search button and look for articles on "Zundel."
Also click on the link at the upper left entitled 'Cabela's Hates
White People' to read the shocking story of how sports retailer
Cabela's wrongfully dismissed a Nebraska employee with an
unblemished record of service to the company. Cabela's fired this
man for his political views after he had become the subject of
news stories in his community because of his courageous
distribution of National Alliance pamphlets warning his fellow
citizens about the dangers of non-White illegal immigration. As
you'll read in the story by National Alliance Western States
Regional Coordinator Roger Williams, a lot of White people are
going to be reconsidering their patronage of Cabela's if they
persist in persecuting an innocent and principled White man -- a
White man who is not backing down. We'll have more on this story
as it develops.
Until next week, this is Kevin Alfred Strom reminding you to do
right and fear no one.